Oil temp measurement - Page 4 - Kawasaki KLR 650 Forum
2008+ KLR650 Wrenching & Mod Questions For repair, maintaining or modifying discussions related to the newly updated 2008 and beyond, Generation 2 KLR650 Motorcycle.

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post #31 of 40 Old 12-16-2018, 06:23 PM
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I have been using Garmin since the mid-90's and have a GPS III, eMap, several Nuvis, and my zumo 660. I live and breathe Basecamp and have a lifetime subscription to maps for my zumo. The ability to plan multi-day trips on the computer and load them to the zumo is paramount. Couldn't live without it.

I know Garmin well and the many idiosyncrasies are, at this point, well understood and simply Germanic.

The Voyager seems like a great idea (and Stevie Wonder could see it's more readable than a zumo; anything is) but I just don't know what the trip planning capabilities are and whether or not you can upload .gpx files to it and download the same. I should look and learn.

The maps seem to be free, but I don't know if they are simply routable maps or if they contain data on rest stops, commercial establishments, fuel, eateries, etc. I don't know if the maps receive periodic updates as the Garmin maps do. Again, I should look and learn.

My zumo is a legacy product with no future firmware updates and, eventually, it will give me trouble with the newest Garmin mapsets. It is also going to fail someday. At that point, I will have to decide if I want to stick with Garmin or try something different.

As far as the color display goes I find it essential. At least on a GPS that I am glancing at on the fly. I rode for quite a few years with my eMap and it was difficult looking at a monochromatic display. Simply not enough contrast between map elements. When I switched to a Nuvi 750 it was a whole new world. Unfortunately, I shook that thing to death on the White Rim trail. I replaced it with the zumo 660.

Monochrome on the Vapor is not an issue because its data is static and in a known format, depending on what screen is selected.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem

Last edited by Tom Schmitz; 12-16-2018 at 06:30 PM. Reason: Chromebook is cranky today
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post #32 of 40 Old 12-16-2018, 08:03 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
I have been using Garmin since the mid-90's and have a GPS III, eMap, several Nuvis, and my zumo 660. I live and breathe Basecamp and have a lifetime subscription to maps for my zumo. The ability to plan multi-day trips on the computer and load them to the zumo is paramount. Couldn't live without it.

I know Garmin well and the many idiosyncrasies are, at this point, well understood and simply Germanic.

The Voyager seems like a great idea (and Stevie Wonder could see it's more readable than a zumo; anything is) but I just don't know what the trip planning capabilities are and whether or not you can upload .gpx files to it and download the same. I should look and learn.

The maps seem to be free, but I don't know if they are simply routable maps or if they contain data on rest stops, commercial establishments, fuel, eateries, etc. I don't know if the maps receive periodic updates as the Garmin maps do. Again, I should look and learn.

My zumo is a legacy product with no future firmware updates and, eventually, it will give me trouble with the newest Garmin mapsets. It is also going to fail someday. At that point, I will have to decide if I want to stick with Garmin or try something different.

As far as the color display goes I find it essential. At least on a GPS that I am glancing at on the fly. I rode for quite a few years with my eMap and it was difficult looking at a monochromatic display. Simply not enough contrast between map elements. When I switched to a Nuvi 750 it was a whole new world. Unfortunately, I shook that thing to death on the White Rim trail. I replaced it with the zumo 660.

Monochrome on the Vapor is not an issue because its data is static and in a known format, depending on what screen is selected.
It looks like the Voyager can use GPX, but it does not appear that the map can be updated. The Voyager Pro has downloadable maps, but appears to have no database for gas stations, food, etc. May have to do the Vapor and a Garmin.
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post #33 of 40 Old 12-16-2018, 10:33 PM
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Your needs will drive the solution.

I need to spend some time understanding the Voyager.

The Vapor is a pretty fair unit, though the tach is problematic. I solved that; I think it needs to be directly connected to the coil through a resistance. Through fiddlin' about I determined what the resistance needed to be but I added a TT resistance wire to my order to see what they put in theirs.

I don't have a picture of what my cockpit looks like with the Garmin mounted, but it is fairly functional. You may have seen my dash; I'll see about getting a picture with the Garmin in place. Might be food for thought.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #34 of 40 Old 12-17-2018, 01:02 PM Thread Starter
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Your needs will drive the solution.

I need to spend some time understanding the Voyager.

The Vapor is a pretty fair unit, though the tach is problematic. I solved that; I think it needs to be directly connected to the coil through a resistance. Through fiddlin' about I determined what the resistance needed to be but I added a TT resistance wire to my order to see what they put in theirs.

I don't have a picture of what my cockpit looks like with the Garmin mounted, but it is fairly functional. You may have seen my dash; I'll see about getting a picture with the Garmin in place. Might be food for thought.
Got this back from Trail Tech:

There is no map in the original Voyager. It will only display GPX files that you download into it.

The Voyager Pro base map will only show topography, streets, highways, and major forest service roads. It will not display any other information like fuel or restaurants.

So, looks like another Garmin for me. I am not into heavy off-roading at my age and that seems to be the design target for the Voyager. Having the database for fuel, food, hotels, etc., is handy so I probably will stay with the devil I know.
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post #35 of 40 Old 12-17-2018, 10:35 PM
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Comparing the -001 and the -003 sensors.


The sensor's tip remains inside the adapter.


Installed in the case.


Not visible in the oil passageway.


Compare and contrast.


Given that you have to have the ability to set up a large piece on a drill press or be fairly adept at free-handing stuff I don't like this method. I think drilling and tapping the OEM test port cap is a better way to go. That part costs only $5 and, even though there is not a lot of meat left in the cap once the M6 is tapped, it's not that hard to hit it dead center. The cap only needs to be torqued enough to hold itself in and the whole shebang is never going to see more than 60psi so it isn't going to bust.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #36 of 40 Old 12-18-2018, 07:42 AM Thread Starter
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...

Given that you have to have the ability to set up a large piece on a drill press or be fairly adept at free-handing stuff I don't like this method. I think drilling and tapping the OEM test port cap is a better way to go. That part costs only $5 and, even though there is not a lot of meat left in the cap once the M6 is tapped, it's not that hard to hit it dead center. The cap only needs to be torqued enough to hold itself in and the whole shebang is never going to see more than 60psi so it isn't going to bust.
Nice work! It looks like the skinny sensor is the way to go as it may even respond faster having the tip in the oil path a little bit. I need to go back in the thread as I cant remember if you showed a pic of the finished plug once drilled. Did you spotface the OEM plug to make a sealing surface for the sensor? Is the sensor wire rigidly attached to the sensor? If that is the case, it appears you need to keep the wire disconnected from the display so that it can rotate as you tighten the sensor. Or does the sensor itself rotate within the brass body so that you can screw it in without twisting the sensor wire?
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post #37 of 40 Old 12-18-2018, 10:11 AM
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When I tapped the OEM plug it was perfectly perpendicular to the top of the plug. The M6 is sealed with a soft washer. Other than chamfering the threaded hole I did nothing to the head of the plug. If I were using a metal crush washer there I would have spotfaced it just on principle. I don't think I have a picture of it anywhere.

The Vapor has short pigtails on it for each function. The leads on the sensors are plenty long enough to reach to the Vapor. I chopped the oil temp sensor's lead off to about 40 cm and made an extension cable to go between the two pigtails. I used the same connectors that Trail Tech uses, even though I don't like them (JWPFs - shudder). The 40 cm pigtail is long enough that I can tie it up on the frame's down tube (so that the JWPFs are secured and not swinging in the breeze) and it allows the sensor to be screwed into the OEM plug.

Leaving the sensor's lead at the original length was a problem for me because of the routing and the need to secure it along the route. If I hadn't chopped it off then I'd have to take half the bike apart everytime I needed to unscrew it, which is far too often given my propensity for messing around with clutches, kickstarters, primary ratios, and oil pressure tomfoolery. All of that seems to be behind me now (Devil, get thee behind me. And don't push.) but the configuration remains.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #38 of 40 Old 10-29-2019, 11:19 AM
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I’m out on a ride around NorCal and have only my phone to search the forum, so I’m necromancing an old post.

Rode up I5 yesterday and noted some temps that were pretty consistent as I was riding due to the constant speed and flat terrain. There are no devices mounted to the engine to attempt to raise temps; everything is stock except for the T-Bob 2. Notes were taken at gas fill-ups

Ambient. Head. Oil. Rad out. Speed.
60. 195. 185. 165. 70
65. 195. 188. 165. 70
70. 196. 193. 170. 70

I am becoming more and more convinced that watt-man’s air dam is the best approach to raise oil temps. I’m going to build one and test it later in the winter with data logging.

Hoping for higher temps on the return trip to see the effect.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem

Last edited by Tom Schmitz; 10-29-2019 at 11:21 AM.
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post #39 of 40 Old 10-29-2019, 05:28 PM
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In Quincy. Ambients have run 40-60, oil has never been over 173. Coolant numbers normal.

Slow And fast twisties, a lot of off-road, some highway.

Tom [email protected]

The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother. -Philip Marlowe

'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used. -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #40 of 40 Old 10-29-2019, 08:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
Im out on a ride around NorCal and have only my phone to search the forum, so Im necromancing an old post.

Rode up I5 yesterday and noted some temps that were pretty consistent as I was riding due to the constant speed and flat terrain. There are no devices mounted to the engine to attempt to raise temps; everything is stock except for the T-Bob 2. Notes were taken at gas fill-ups

Ambient. Head. Oil. Rad out. Speed.
60. 195. 185. 165. 70
65. 195. 188. 165. 70
70. 196. 193. 170. 70

I am becoming more and more convinced that watt-mans air dam is the best approach to raise oil temps. Im going to build one and test it later in the winter with data logging.

Hoping for higher temps on the return trip to see the effect.
Thank you for posting the temperature data. I'm surprised that there's such a wide disparity between water temperature and oil temperature.

In my mind, the oil temperature is the critical one. A thermobob for the oil to get temps in the 190-220F range would be beneficial.

Jason
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