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I stink at mounting the rear tire.

11K views 56 replies 15 participants last post by  lineman1234 
#1 ยท
SO, I have a bridgestone trail wing rear tire, the stock one didn't last very long at all. Front didn't last long either. BUT, the front tire is also a bridgestone trail wing, and went on like a dream.
The rear, first time, pinched the tube, a lot, put in new tube, tried letting sit in sun and still didn't go on. Took It to a tire shop, and it was fine for about 3,000, miles then noticed low rear tire. Took tube out, pinched spot where I pinched it again, the second time installed. Just put in a new tube, couldn't get the last part of tire on, again. Took it to a tire shop, and found I pinched it again. ( my fault for not checking to see if I pinched it again, before going to tire shop.) I have a new tube on the way and will just install it and not try to put tire on, but go right to tire shop for $10 to have them put it on.
What is a softer install tire, I can install next time I need a new rear? Im more 70/30 ,,70 on road.
I don't mind making mistakes, but this is the 3rd time.
 
#2 ยท
Are you putting a little air in the tube before you put it in the tire? Put in just enough to get it round, but not starting to expand. That way it can still be compressed when putting it in between the rim and tire. Then, just go slow and do not push in your irons to far. Make sure the tube is not under the iron before you start to move the bead on to the rim. Using tire lube also helps to get the tire bead into the rim. I use No Mar lube. I used this method and did not have any problems with pinching the tube. Then I got a No Mar changer and it made changing tires much easier.
 
#3 ยท (Edited)
In the shop, I work on top of a automotive wheel & tire. So that the bike brake disc is protected & down away from my knuckles. This elevates the wheel and allows ones Knees to keep the first 2/3 of installed bead compressed into the spoke drop center so that the last 1/3 of bead can be (more) easily slipped over the rim.
Of course the tire iron flat tip can only be inserted about 1/4 - 1/2 inch over the rim lip. If inserted TOO Far you will still pinch the tube.
Also, only install 2 -3 inches of bead at a time.

Motion Pro tools makes the "Bead Buddy", which 2 or 3 of them could keep the bead down in the drop center also. As I get older & less flexible I may have to purchase a few. They might need a little modifying of the 'spoke hook' to engage on the KLR wheel.
 
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#4 ยท
Proper tire installation is a matter of technique more than anything. I haven't pinched a tire for 25 years now (41 bikes so far). There are lots of youtube videos out there - some tips:
- use lube (I use WD40 but you can use a specialty lube like RuGlide or even talcum powder)
- use HD real rubber tubes
- partially inflate the tube (but not too much)
- use tire irons that don't have sharp edges
- make sure the tire opposite of your tire iron has both beads in the center of the rim.
- don't take "bites" that are too big - a little at a time.

IMO, it's best to learn to do it right so you can fix it yourself if/when the need arises.

Dave
 
#7 ยท
How wide is the spare wheel on your car, truck, jeep, trailer? A 15 inch rim is large enough ID for the biggest of sport bike brake discs. With a tire mounted, it protects mag wheel spokes from damage. One can even stack 2 automotive wheel assemblies if you have back issues.
 
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#11 ยท
I use one of these that I made a stand for; welded to a 2.5" sched. 40 steel pipe and a spare car rim;

Ive seen these and initially itโ€™s what I was going to buy. Still might, but Iโ€™d have to find a place to put it when not in use. Iโ€™ve also heard the bead breaker can be fairly flimsy and bend on you depending on what model/vendor you buy.

So, Iโ€™ve been thinking of the No-Mar and the Rabaconda IIRC. Both are at working bright and the latter packs away into a bag when not in use.
 
#38 ยท
Hello Dave, I too have changed a lot of tires... but still struggle with getting both beads into the drop center when changing tires on my own. Wondering if there is something you can suggest ?
I see in another post that the bead buddy is not very effective.
 
#14 ยท
The first time I changed a tire, I struggled with it for hours, and I was doing it wrong. Then I watched a video by Rocky Mountain ATV/MC, and I've had very little trouble since then. I don't even have all the fancy tools; I only have two bicycle tire spoons, but I can still do it, and I've even used them to change ATV tires.

For me, it's about having a good solid place to work (Black & Decker Workmate allows the sprocket and brake rotor to avoid pressure), a warm tire, and some slickum. I just use diluted Simple Green for my slickum. The hardest part is the bead lock. Push the tire bead as deep as you can into the spoke valley, and you should have no trouble getting the tire on and off.
 
#15 ยท
Tire changing is 80% technique, 15% the right tools and 5% effort. At my tech days we will often do Tire Changing 101. Watching others try it becomes obvious they think its 80% effort, 15% right tools and 5% technique lol.

I'm picky about my tire irons. I like MotionPro old school short narrow tip for my working spoon and the other two spoons I don't care what type; narrow tip, large spoon, short, long etc. Next helpful tool is MotionPro bead buddy. Lube (RuGlyle from Napa or gel from NoMar) is always used in the shop. On the trail its nice to have but technique becomes more important without. You can pick up a 15" auto rim for free easily. There are several methods and you can try several and/or develop you own.

I often refer others to a 5 or 6 part short video by searching youtube - 'Bridgestone Doug Schopinsky' For one method.
 
#16 ยท
I often refer others to a 5 or 6 part short video by searching youtube - 'Bridgestone Doug Schopinsky' For one method.



My oldest had a hell of a time learning spoons and not pinching. Mainly from bull in a china shop mode. he had trouble learning the finesse/feel. I bought him some MP T6 spoons to try. I didn't know it until I had them in my hand but the one with the 10/12mm end for the adjusters has a tiny lip on it. You slip the spoon in and rest it the lip on the rim edge and it wont let you pinch. Using this he figured out how to do it. Its pretty foolproof provided you arent mounting a seriously stiff obnoxious sidewall tire.

Then I took the tool back for myself :laugh3: and made him buy his own

I use the No Mar lube as Chuck mentioned.

https://www.motionpro.com/product/08-0588
 

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#17 ยท
I do have the bead buddy, it helps a lot, and a set of 3, spoons, use dawn dishsoap to lube. Tire goes on fine until the last 10-12 inches, then its a no go. Everything for me needs to be portable. I have a manual bead breaker that works great.
I thank all for the responces. Ill have it mounted this time when the tube comes in. Then when I need a new tire, ill remove tube and try to install the tire back on to see if I can get it on, as it is junk anyway. Off road is one thing, on road I have AAA, and can be towed up to 250 miles.
their is a couple simple cheep mounting, manual, machines, that I could break down and store in the back camper storage. I like the one that has the hitch mount to give leverage. That ones $400, I could get the $130 one and make the hitch mount when I get to my friends farm this spring.
comparing the stock soft tire to the bridgestone, is like a sponge to a rock.
 
#19 ยท (Edited)
Last few inches....thats where the 80% technique comes in. A story I've repeated a few times....tech day and one of the KLR owners was struggling with that last 10". After letting him struggle a bit I walked over and walked thru what you do...seconds later the tire is on. He's all happy and turned and was talking to others. I quickly slipped the tire back off and handed it back to him saying...try again. The look I got was unforgettable lol. A few tech days later he was now helping others with learning how to change tires. He went home and practiced installing his old tire repeatedly till he got the hang of it.


AAA or other services is a waste of time. You should be proficient enough to handle any tire repairs on the trail. Besides, I don't know where you ride but most of mine is in open desert. No cell phone to call AAA and besides...they would never travel off road anyways. Moot point. Learn to do your own tire changes. Great idea to practice with the old tire. I carry all my tools in a fanny pack. Again, if you are struggling you are doing it wrong.
 
#21 ยท
Thanks, im mostly on road and or gravel and fire roads. Ill practice when I need a new tire. The tube should be in today, ill be first inline at the tire shop tomorrow. I need the triple A for when I travel and am not near a friend I can call to get me.
I have only had the KLR for 6,300 new miles, and had to get rescued once because of something I did while installing the paniers.
 
#22 ยท
YAAAAYYYYY.... Got tire mounted last night ( at tire shop), going to install it right after coffee, and back on the road. Not to much, Trail riding hear where I am at in Rockport TX, but lots of nice roads to explore. The bike is so much more fun to explore with than the truck with the windows down.
The paniers, and the cheep and dirty, black milk crate on the back rack, is perfect to go to the grocery store.
The one thing I notice being close to the salt water, is the chain don't like it. It rusts on the side, and it needs to constantly be lubed.
 
#27 ยท
...The one thing I notice being close to the salt water, is the chain don't like it. It rusts on the side, and it needs to constantly be lubed.
@lineman1234

You might consider carrying a small can of WD-40 to spray on the chain.

I live at the beach and have no issues with rust on the chain and the only thing I put on the chain is WD-40. I put it on at the end of each day's ride, spraying it liberally onto the chain and giving it a quick wipe with a rag if I happen to have one.

I just replaced my sprockets and chain as a result of a gearing change. The sprockets and chain were on for 13,083 miles. I measured the chain lengths over a span of 77 links and found that the chain had worn 0.13%. That is, it was supposed to measure 48 1/8" and it measured 48 3/16". That's not as long a test of WD-40 as watt-man has done, but that ain't much wear.
 
#23 ยท (Edited)
Awesome. Itโ€™s great to be back on the road isnโ€™t it?

As for the chain, I havenโ€™t tried it yet, but I bought some Motol chain paste to try. Thought it might stick better. No mess. And not let too much dirt stick to it.

Just out of curiosity, what did it cost to mount your tire? Last one I did was about $50 to mount and balance and I supplied everything for it. Main reason I figured Iโ€™d start doing it myself.
 
#24 ยท
I have had it mounted 2 times now, as mentioned, this is my 3rd tube. I had it done in MN this past summer, $15, and 2 times hear, because I pinched the tube again. Its $10, each time, hear in Rockport TX. In Fritch TX I had my 2,500 truck tire taken off and plugged for $10, that was great. $20, to fix a chip in the windshield.
For the tire, I had it all ready to go, New tube in, one side rubber on, other side, (didn't touch this time) I have the valve stem fishing tool, WHAT A NUCKLE SAVER!!!
Call and ask around, lots of machanics with the mounting machine that will do it at home for some cash. I find I don't need it balanced, yet, $50 seems a bit high, but I would have paid it, as I didn't have a choice. Till I/if I, learn to mount myself.
The chain, someone gave me chain wax, and it don't do anything for the salty air. I think the salt likes it.
 
#25 ยท
The chain, someone gave me chain wax, and it don't do anything for the salty air. I think the salt likes it.

Well I hope the paste is different from the wax then. Wonโ€™t know until I try it out.

$15 to mount a tire is much more reasonable. The shops I called all quoted similar prices. Hence the idea to buy my own stand as itโ€™ll pay for itself pretty quick.
 
#26 ยท
I NEED TO UPDATE THE STORY.
Checked air in tire I had mounted yesterday, NO air, added air and sprayed with soapy water, lots of bubbles. Took one side off again and pulled brand new tube out. They put 2 holes in new tube about 5 inches apart. Thank goodness I ordered 2 tubes for one as a spare.
SO, I put air in other new tube and tested for leaks, none.
put new second tube in and commenced to very, slowly and feeling before putting tire iron in, feeling for tube, and being very slow, and ginger, got the darn thing on.
Going for a ride.
Going to try my hand at patching the 2 tubes I have. ha ha ......
Thanks all for the help and inspiration.
 
#28 ยท
lineman1234,
The secrets to successful inner tube patching are to 'Scruff' the tube with scratcher or 100 grit sand paper until a slightly over-sized area is BLACK bare rubber and then let a very Thin coating of the vulcanizing cement DRY before adhering the patch.

Tom,
Do I remember correctly that chain companies say 1.5% - 2.0% increase of length of a drive chain is considered "Worn-Out"? So your chain was less than 10% of the allowable increase.
So I'm wondering just how many usable used drive chains you have in the Shed of Horrors? :)
 
#30 ยท (Edited)
Tom,
Do I remember correctly that chain companies say 1.5% - 2.0% increase of length of a drive chain is considered "Worn-Out"? So your chain was less than 10% of the allowable increase.
So I'm wondering just how many usable used drive chains you have in the Shed of Horrors? :)
I don't know what "chain companies" consider worn-out, but in the bicycle chain world, 0.75% elongation means replace the chain soon and 1.0% elongation means replace chain and sprockets now. Here's a pic of a bicycle chain wear checking tool.

To use the tool, simply engage the radiused-end of the 0.75% side on a roller and see if the hooked-end will fit between rollers. If the hooked-end drops down between rollers on the 0.75% scale flip the tool over and perform the same check on the 1% scale. If it "drops" between rollers on the 0.75% side/scale but not the 1%, you have some life remaining in the chain. If the tool drops on both sides/scales replace chain and sprockets.

It seems it would be easy enough to make a similar tool to check motorcycle chains.

Jason
 

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#29 ยท
Just the one. I had a 520 non-oring chain laying around but just tossed it last week as I figured I'd never use it. It was in fine shape, too. I think it might have been on my Ossa Pioneer or the Norton. Can't remember, nor can I remember if either of those even used a 520 chain. I know that it wasn't for the CX500... Nor would it have been for any of the other Hondas.

The chain and sprockets that I just took off are in fine shape with many miles left, so I am keeping them as a set to go with my knobby wheels. Heaven knows if I will ever really use those wheels again, but I have a set of bearings I ought to put into them, just 'cuz.
 
#31 ยท
Or just grab the chain at the rear of the rear sprocket and pull. If you see daylight between the chain and sprocket you should have a new chain on hand or one on its way. Chains develop tight and loose sections...adjust the chain slack to the tight section and check for worn out chain on the loose section.
 
#32 ยท
Krause Racing / Sidewinder Sprockets used to make "The Judge" for 520/525/530 chain size at least.

I never purchased one and don't know whether they are still available, or not.
 
#34 ยท
I ran trail wings once, found they were difficult to put on as well. Now I use Shinko 705s, the ones made for tubes seem easier to mount than the ones that are tubeless.
 
#40 ยท
As long as I use some lube, I've not experienced many issues getting the bead into the groove. I have bead buddies but I only use them maybe half the time....if things get a bit difficult. The "zip tie" method makes this issue dissappear but I didn't find it to be a game changer like some have expressed.....

Dave
 
#41 ยท
Chuck,

I think you should make a video and show how to do it. I had a Harbor Freight tire changer, a No MAr bar, and the little nylon clamping blocks for stand. For the life of me, I cold not get the tire changed. I was frustrated and sold it all. I had a local shop do all my tire changes. However, I'm now in a more rural area (we moved out of SoCal) and eventually would like to try doing my own again.
 
#42 ยท
Go back to page #2 on this thread. Flexiflier posted the youtube link that I had suggested as a video tutorial. Its a 5 or 6 part video(s). Doug does a couple things different than my technique but his works very well with offroad type tires i.e. KLR. I have different techniques depending on style of bike (heavy cruiser with tubes to sport bike tubeless) Spooning tires over tire balls or even Nutech Tubliss setup all require slight different method/tips. Fact is, if you can install a tire using tire balls or Michelin Moouse Bibs you are an official tire installation expert. Took me a LONG time to get where I could do those easily with basic tools. Technique is mandatory lol.


Over at .net I did a whole review of the Harbor Freight tire changer. Out of the box...not very good but with a couple key upgrades its actually not that bad. I did the same with a couple of the NoMar models. Out of the box they were worlds better than HF even after upgrades but a couple of their supplied 'tools' I didn't care for. With a doz or so tire changes trying different tools/methods I actually kept the basic NoMar model for my own shop. Previously I only used a 15" tire rim on a stand or for many years just a 16" drum. I still do sport bike tires on the 15" rim...still much faster than using the NoMar or any tire changer I've used over the years.
 
#45 ยท
So,,,, I thought I didn't stink at the front, but I also do. This past winter in TX, I had front go slowly flat, now few days ago have front going flat again. Just so happens I ordered the banjo no pinch tire tool, and it should be in any day now.
So ill be testing it out sooner than I thought, as front is getting worn, and I have a new on hand, but other is still good.
If I find another pinched tube, Ill be going tubeless.
 
#46 ยท
I have found dish soap makes a good lube, it also helps clean the rim when I wash it off. Over the years I have pinched a lot of tubes, I keep a good stash of tire patches on hand. Like I said before, if the tire design is made in a tubeless version they are easier. Like others posted, I only move my spoons 1"-2" at a time while keeping the trailing bead in the spoke well. Patience is the key!
 
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