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post #21 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 08:48 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
Please explain what is in a "good motorcycle oil" that is not covered under the JASO MA. JASO MA means more than 'wet clutch compatible'.

Bear in mind, though, that irrespective of all the hype, bullshit, and advertising talk that appears on the outside of the bottle, in ads, or on websites, the only thing you really know about the oil is what is inside that little emblem on the back that list the spec the oil conforms to. Other words, like "4-Stroke", "Racing 4T", "V-Twin 4T" don't mean diddly. In fact, "V-Twin 4T" probably means it's ordinary engine oil.

The spec is the spec.

Oil. It's a marvel, it's a mystery.
Exactly,
If the V twin designation meant anything substantial, it would differentiate between air or liquid cooled and shared trans or separate trans.. There's a VAST difference between a Kawasaki or Honda V twin and a Harley.

Never pick a fight with an old man.. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you..
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post #22 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MrZappo View Post
Now, a KTM 1290S (oh the humanity !!!), Now that girl would get the good stuff.
Once, in my misspent youth, in a foreign country, I entered a club/bar/dive/etc. with some of my rifle team companions.

The maitre d'hotel seated us, and offered the company of the hostesses employed by the establishment to join us socially for cocktails.

He informed us, "They drink only champagne."

He was right, according to our bar tabs.

Similarly, my KTMs drink only Motul!

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post #23 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 08:56 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motoz View Post
You are right, oil is a marvel and a mystery. JASA MA is specified for motorcycles using the same oil lubricating the engine and wet clutch.

I'm not a chemist, but here is a good quote from Motorcyclist magazine.

"Itís possible to find automotive oil with the appropriate API service type and viscosity range in a non-energy-conserving formulation, but that doesnít necessarily mean itís appropriate for use in your bike. There are some key differences between motorcycle engines and car engines, most notably the fact that motorcycles have shared sumps. The meat grinder that is the transmission is tough on the viscosity index modifiers and calls for high-pressure and anti-wear additives that arenít part of the normal automotive-oil package. Add to that the fact that motorcycle engines make more power per liter, spin faster, and run hotter than car engines and itís pretty clear that picking motorcycle-specific oil is important."
What about the quad cam Harley sportster engine? That engine has a set of 4 gear driven cams and a pinion gear driven oil pump. Plenty of heat and shear going on inside.. IF you read the owners manual, Harley says they recommend you use "Genuine Harley Davidson 20W50 Motor Oil", BUT in the case you cannot find it, USE 15W40 DIESEL ENGINE OIL..
I'd be willing to bet you if you tested many other Diesel engine oils they too would meet JASO specs. They just never saw the need to pay the $ to get certified as they are not marketing their oil towards a motorcycle.

Never pick a fight with an old man.. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you..
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post #24 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 09:03 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
Once, in my misspent youth, in a foreign country, I entered a club/bar/dive/etc. with some of my rifle team companions.

The maitre d'hotel seated us, and offered the company of the hostesses employed by the establishment to join us socially for cocktails.

He informed us, "They drink only champagne."

He was right, according to our bar tabs.

Similarly, my KTMs drink only Motul!

I too spent a small fortune in similar bars overseas in my youthful "young dumb and full of cum" days.. It was a good time though.

Never pick a fight with an old man.. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you..
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post #25 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 09:08 PM
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I admit to once being young and dumb.

As of today I am no longer young.

Waiter, a motul for the lady. I'll just have a beer. Sure hope my wife don't mind if she accompanies me home from the dealer someday.

She sure is pretty. And that orange hair !
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post #26 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrZappo View Post
...Oil is not a mystery....
I think you might have missed the joke.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
...Oil. It's a marvel, it's a mystery.

Tom [email protected]

ďThe kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother.Ē -Philip Marlowe

ď'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used.Ē -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
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post #27 of 64 Old 02-20-2019, 11:59 PM
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As I said, still dumb. But happy.

Sorry for the miss.
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post #28 of 64 Old 02-21-2019, 03:07 AM
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The allusion to "Marvel Mystery" motor oil may be effective, generationally, MrZappo! You cannot possibly have the same knowledge of arcane trivia possessed by us, the SENILE!

My memories of Marvel Mystery: The concentric circle optical illusion the vendor used in its marketing; the "demonstration" where automobiles were fortified with Marvel Mystery, then run with DRAINED crankcases across the American desert in the summertime . . . surely, a Marvel Mystery!
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post #29 of 64 Old 02-21-2019, 05:37 AM
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FYI Damocles

The KLR650 Clymer Manual does does caution specifically against the use of energy conserving classified oils;

"When ENERGY CONSERVING is listed in this part of the the (API Service symbol) label, the oil has demonstrated energy-conserving properties in the standard tests. Do not us ENERGY CONSERVING oil in motorcycle engines".

This does not necessarily reflect or conflict with my opinion. I just thought it might be of interest to you. Like your's, my owner's manual does not mention energy conserving oil.

Cheers

Timberfoot
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post #30 of 64 Old 02-21-2019, 06:02 AM
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MMO gets my vote for "best oil additive can design." In a culture where people like to analyze things to death, I'm surprised some sage has not yet revealed the hidden meanings of that logo...........
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