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Laboratory Oil Analysis Thread!

85K views 187 replies 28 participants last post by  mzebley 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Tom Schmitz,
A while back in "Oil Pressure, How Much Ya' Got?", you suggested that you would/did send in a sample! I have not seen it.
I'd like to see it.

So, I'd like to go first.




I will suggest, it looks Excellent considering I have 3000 miles or 1.5 times the Average (1900miles) on this oil. I think I will go to 5000 mile intervals.
Paul
 
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#2 ·
I have a sample to share! It's sitting on my workbench in the Shop of Horrors.

I'll get it sent off...

Tom
 
#5 ·
For the most part, I use Rotella T 15W-40. It is API SM and JASO MA certified and I usually find it on sale for $11-$12.

I've also used Delo 400 LE, though it doesn't have the JASO MA rating. I've never had a problem with it. I buy that when it's on sale for $11-$12, and Rotella isn't, and I haven't planned well enough to have Rotella on hand.

My oil change interval has been 3,000 miles. I'm willing to extend that based upon an oil analysis.

Tom
 
#4 ·
It would be interesting to Know, How many Samples make up Blackstones 'KLR Universal Averages'?

As I think my first sample impacted the 'Universal Averages' and there may or may not have been any KLR samples between my TWO!
 
#6 ·
Great. I use Rotella too so it would be nice to see your results.
 
#7 ·
Tom,
I forgot to say, Thank You this AM for your help, again.
So, Thank You my friend!

I did send an e-mail to Blackstone Labs, asking if they might divulge 'how many samples?' might currently make-up Their 'Universal Averages'?

No response by this evening, but I'm certain they will, soon.

Anybody else have any OLD or NEW KLR650 Laboratory oil Analysis reports, which you would care to share?
Running perfect or trying to 'trace a problem', it really doesn't matter, just as long as we Know, there may have been a 'problem' or not, hopefully!
 
#8 ·
Just got an answer back from Blackstone Labs.


Paul,
You're right! That's an easy one. At this point, we have 30 different
samples in our average file for that engine.

Let us know if you have any more questions!

Have a happy Thanksgiving,
Amanda Callahan
Blackstone Laboratories

At 12:50 PM 11/20/2014, you wrote:
>Good morning to the Blackstone Team,
>I have a reasonably simple question. How many samples make up Your
>'Universal Averages' for the Kawasaki KLR650 motorcycle? If I am allowed
>that info?
>Thank You,
>Paul D. Westman
 
#10 · (Edited)
Maybe I gotta quit whipping Black Betty so hard...



I've got another kit on hand and will pull another sample at 2,000.

Tom
 
#12 ·
I don't understand the 'Insolubles'. 0.4%!
Aren't aluminum, chromium, iron, 'silica' an 'Insoluble'?

The chromium and iron are over Double.
I guess, it's about correct on an average. 0.4%, about double of 'Universal Averages', over-all.
Don't panic. Maybe, change your Brand of oil, Early.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Tom,
The only thing I can say is, "WOW"! The Aluminum and Iron are almost 'off the chart'.
Don't panic, yet!
The silicon seems 'weird', to me. I thought 'silica' was sand. And 'silicon' was a synthetic petroleum product?

The viscosity, Is holding better than my Kawasaki oil, though. Not much consolation tho.

The only RTV silicone on my engine, is 2 little dabs, on the alternator wire grommets.
Thanks for sharing.

ps, What oil DID you use at the change, if I may ask?

Who's Next?
 
#13 · (Edited)
Paul-

It was ridden real hard this time. WOT in third and fourth up every grade and pass encountered in Utah, Wyoming, and Montana. Ran 70-80 everywhere else except Yellowstone, where I sorta observed the speed limit.

Same story running up into the Sierras and into Death Valley. There was a lot of high temps, too - up in the 110 range coming home from Montana.

That was Rotella, and I replaced it with Rotella.

I'm not worried until I see the next one.

Tom
 
#14 · (Edited)
Paul -

I am a newbie at this stuff, so I referred to this to understand: http://www.blackstone-labs.com/report-explanation.php

Apparently, 'insolubles' are from oil oxidization with blow-by gases.

I agree on on the silicon/silica issue, though. On their explanation that lump sealers and airborne grit under "silicon" and that doesn't seem correct. The only explanation I can think of is that, when they do their chemical analysis, silica and silicon look the same (silica is an oxide of silicon, which is an element) to whatever the detection agent is and so they lump them together.

It is easy to confuse silicon with silicone. Silicon is a natural element, while silicone is man-made from silicon and other chemicals. Silicon is used as a semiconductor in microchips and such, and silicone is usually a rubbery substance that is a non-conductor.

Tom
 
#16 · (Edited)
Tom,
Do you have a 'Magnetic' Oil Drain Plug??

I installed a Motion Pro 'Oil Filter magnet' Ring, at the 63,944 mile mark, when I started my 'Project'. First Magnet ever in my engine! Looks like the best place to me. Catches the 'fine stuff', which come thru the oil screen!

I think the first one, (I now own 3) may have picked up ferrous material from 63,944 miles of Previous Useage! The heavy Iron settles to the bottom, before it all drains Out. If we catch the 'fine stuff', the first time, it keeps it from becoming 'Finer'! And ending up 'microscopic', suspended in our Oil Samples.

I could be incorrect, just some of my thoughts.

Eventually, I will install one of my used oil filter magnets onto the Back-End of the oil filter, to maybe catch ferrous material before it goes THRU the cold start By-Pass Valve.

No reason other than $'s, that one couldn't use 3 magnets in our engines.
Drain plug and each end of the oil FILTER! They are Re-Useable, as long as one Remembers to remove, wipe and re-install on New Oil Filter.

ps, 10 Guests viewing. I like to see that!
 
#17 ·
On an average week, I turn in 40 to 50 oil samples. I am a heavy equipment mechanic and we use these samples to look for trends. One sample in and of itself will not necessarily predict problems. I wish I hadn't deleted my electronic copies of my KLR samples. I rarely run the same brand of oil, so the Rotella comparisons wouldn't be apples to apples. I've had no coolant entry or high wear metals in my samples, which is good! My interval runs 3-5,000 miles. I'm waiting to do the first real oil change since the 685 install and see if anything changed.

WHen you guys do your samples, make sure you let the oil run out of the the drain plug for a couple of seconds before you stick the bottle in the stream and make sure your drain plug area is CLEAN before draining the oil.

I'm curious what Blackstone charges for their analysis.
 
#18 ·
My sample may have been tainted because I didn't catch the early part of the drain; it was more towards the latter part of the drain. I learned you're supposed to let a wee bit drain out, then shove the bottle under there while the stuff is gushing out all over the place, thereby burning your hand. I waited until the drain slowed down to a "don't burn the crap out of your hand in the hot oil" level.

Live and learn.

Blackstone charges $25.

Tom
 
#19 ·
I used a clean Glass 16oz 'salsa jar' to capture my 2 different samples.
Less likely to slobber hot oil over my hands trying to hit a small neck sample jar and No Mess on official sample jar. Also gives 'spare sample' if first were to get lost in the mail.
My samples were taken after about the first quart was in the pan, just as Blackstone suggests on their web site. www.blackstone-labs.com

As Tom said $25.00 fee and I remember less than $3.00 for my postage.

Also I like the 'lay-out' of the Blackstone reports. Easy to read and compare to other Blackstone reports.

Tom, I don't think it matters a bit that you may have caught the last 8-16 oz.
 
#20 ·
Paul -

I do have a magnetic drain plug and it always has a bit of fuzz on it at each oil change. I think that's pretty normal.

I have some ring magnets that I need to check and see if they will fit over the bypass tube.

Tom
 
#21 ·
Come on, Guys and Gals,
Show us all, that Synthetic ROTELLA / Mobil 1 / Castrol Edge or Syn-Tech / Lucas / Bel-Ray / Royal Purple / Ams-Oil / Red-Line or even Kawasaki's 100% Full Synthetic Engine oil can Exceed my LOW, 'Wear Metals Numbers'!!!!

On a 5000 mile or even 3000 mile oil change interval!!

I WANT to see IT. Give me a reason to change UP. To a 7500 mile Oil Change Interval! Like the New Gen2 Owners Manuals say we can!
 
#22 · (Edited)
I have found a few other oil analysis reports, scattered thru the 2 forums which I participate.

JeffSaline used Butler Cat so No 'UA'#s! Dated 06/21/08
JeffSaline,------ Rotella 15w40,----- 2000miles---Iron14ppm---Alum35ppm--Copper7ppm--Silicon9ppm--dated06/21/08

kelly1005, must have been among the first few to use Blackstone as 'Universal Averages' appear to be based on very low mileage bikes, with early analysiss'.
kelly1005, has a total of 4 of Them! Dating back to 09/21/08.
'UA'ppms---Alum9--Chrom2--Iron19--Copper25--Lead7--dated06/08/09

kelly1005,
Motul10W40mixed w/ Castrol 20W50-2430miles--Iron14ppm--Alum11ppm--Copper4ppm--Silicon5ppm--dated06/08/09

Limitedslip,----Mobil 1 15W50,------2500miles---Iron35ppm---Alum40ppm--Copper18ppm-Silicon10ppm--dated08/23/12

Johntripwire,--Red Line20W50,------3731miles---Iron74ppm---Alum20ppm--Copper11ppm-Silicon18ppm--dated07/01/14

Tom Schmitz,-RotellaT15W40,-------3514miles---Iron55ppm---Alum58ppm--Copper22ppm-Silicon19ppm--dated12/10/14

Me, pdw-------Kawa. 10W40,--------5061miles---Iron32ppm---Alum22ppm--Copper7ppm--Silicon11ppm--dated11/10/13

Me, pdw-------Kawa. 10W40,--------3011miles---Iron23ppm---Alum14ppm--Copper4ppm--Silicon7ppm--dated08/11/14
 
#23 · (Edited)
Just for comparisons sake,

Playing with the numbers between kelly1005's, 2400 mile report and my 3000 mile report and my 5000 mile report.

If we extrapolate the 2400 and 3000 mile reports to the 5000 mile mark, they might look like this. Iron14ppm divide by 2.4=5.83333 x 5.0=29.16666ppm.

kelly1005@5000 miles--Iron29.2ppm--Alum22.9ppm--Copper8.3ppm--Silicon10.4, maybe!
pdw @ 5000 miles-------Iron38.3ppm--Alum23.3ppm--Copper6.6ppm--Silicon11.6ppm, maybe!

My previous 5000 miles-Iron32ppm----22ppm----------Copper7ppm----Silicon11-- Actual Report from 11/10/13

I still think my petroleum oil has performed 'pretty darn'ed Well'! The proof is yet to come.
We will see my 2nd 5000 mile report some time next year, I ain't changing it!
 
#24 ·
Calling on multi bike owners,

How many of you have Blackstone Oil Analysis Reports for other models?
DR650, XL600, XR650L, XT600, KTM620s?

I'd/we'd like to see them, Please.

I'd even try to compare other lab reports, but they should/need to have a 'Universal Average' for your brand/model of bike.
 
#25 ·
Ive never used Blackstone before, I work for a heavy equipment company that has our own lab. I can't imagine that there are any other KLRs in the system to compare to. I'll try and research it to see if there are.
 
#42 ·
19willys51,
Have you by any chance had your Local Lab do an oil analysis on your KLR?

How about it Wayne_I? Do you have anything to share with us?
 
#26 ·
ive used them for our fleet trucks never thought of testing my klr .. but it would tell us if its really needed to swap out our oil ever 3k miles .. ive always tended for the 5k mark unless I I did a lot of dusty dirt riding ..
 
#27 ·
Bump, and a thought.

Wayne, If dusty road riding (<60mph) vs Highway riding (>60mph) makes any difference to the oil inside of the engine, I'd suggest your bike or automobile has air filtration issues! The silicon/silica content in the oil sample will show it!
ANY dust passed the air filter is Too Much dust! It leads to gross oil consumption.

Just ask Tom.
 
#28 ·
Just a 'Bump', to stir your interest!!

Bring it "ON"!
Surpass my wear metal numbers, per mile.
Convince me, that "your oil is better, than mine"!
SHOW ME THE PROOF!!! Or at least, attempt to!
Blackstone Laboratories. $28.00 USD including your separate Postage price!!

Apologies to the Canadians among us, it may cost more. I'll read your report from whom ever Laboratory, with Extra 'scrutiny'!
 
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