I'm an outlaw biker - Kawasaki KLR 650 Forum
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post #1 of 18 Old 09-29-2010, 11:36 PM Thread Starter
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I'm an outlaw biker

Yeah, me.

The Governor of California has signed a bill authorizing California LEOs to ticket motorcycles with altered emissions, which includes swapping out the exhaust.

Though the enforcement is just a fix-it ticket, this will be interesting to watch.

Keep your stock parts; they are about to increase in value.

Oh, and my exhaust says 'Suzuki' on it...

Tom

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“The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother.” -Philip Marlowe

“'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used.” -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
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post #2 of 18 Old 09-29-2010, 11:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
Yeah, me.

The Governor of California has signed a bill authorizing California LEOs to ticket motorcycles with altered emissions, which includes swapping out the exhaust.

Though the enforcement is just a fix-it ticket, this will be interesting to watch.

Keep your stock parts; they are about to increase in value.

Oh, and my exhaust says 'Suzuki' on it...

Tom
All the better for our trip.




"In a car you're always in a compartment, and because you're used to it you don't realize that through that car window everything you see is just more TV." R. Pirsig

PPMC #1.
Soon, we ride.

AKA JD Mader or you can call me "Dan" just not early for dinner.

Click my handle for a link to my homepage/blog...which has nothing to do with MCs. Free literature and music! Viva La Revolucion!
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post #3 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
Yeah, me.

The Governor of California has signed a bill authorizing California LEOs to ticket motorcycles with altered emissions, which includes swapping out the exhaust.

Though the enforcement is just a fix-it ticket, this will be interesting to watch.

Keep your stock parts; they are about to increase in value.

Oh, and my exhaust says 'Suzuki' on it...

Tom

Doesn't take effect until 2013 and isn't retroactive.

Schwarzenegger tells motorcyclists to pipe down, signs noise bill

The author of the bill wanted it to take effect next year but was talked out of it. He also was the author of the bill a couple of years ago to start smog checks on motorcycles. He admitted that the real purpose was noise not smog.

No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him. 1 Cor 2:9
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post #4 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 09:53 AM Thread Starter
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Spec -

Thanks for posting the link.

Even as a real Outlaw Biker, I think it's a bit of a shame that it is so far out in effectivity, and why they are so gutless as to shroud the issue around emissions and not take the noise issue straight on. It seems pretty toothless. I suppose that gives all us outlaws time to get into compliance and quiet down.... ;^)

I'm puzzled as to why they just couldn't enact a bill that required a match-up of the EPA cert on the exhaust to the bike and make it effective immediately.

Whether or not there are challenges, and the nature and authors of the challenges, may be interesting.

Tom

Tom [email protected]

“The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother.” -Philip Marlowe

“'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used.” -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #5 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post

...

I think it's a bit of a shame that it is so far out in effectivity, and why they are so gutless as to shroud the issue around emissions and not take the noise issue straight on. It seems pretty toothless. I suppose that gives all us outlaws time to get into compliance and quiet down.... ;^)

Lot of Harley riders out there! They have more money/influence than in the past, more lawyers, dentists, accounts, etc. rilding!

Really lets be honest about this law it's because of the piratey guys blasting everybody with their "life saving" pipes. Yea there's other loud bikes but it's the Harleys that are to blame for this. A guy at work bought a $30K Harley recently and one of the first things he did was put loud pipes on it. I asked him why and he said it was because the bike was too corked up stock, he wanted more performance. I wanted to ask him why he got a Harley in the first place if he wanted performance!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Schmitz View Post
I'm puzzled as to why they just couldn't enact a bill that required a match-up of the EPA cert on the exhaust to the bike and make it effective immediately.

Whether or not there are challenges, and the nature and authors of the challenges, may be interesting.

Tom
Local communities can and have enacted the EPA label match up, why the states don't?

Orginally the bill was to take effect next year and be retroactive to 1983 bikes!

No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him. 1 Cor 2:9
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post #6 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 10:28 AM
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Tom, Give it time and Ca. will build a wall around there boarder and call themselfs a Nation on there own. Me I'm hoping this Shyt hole state will slide off the face of the earth first...........just need to move out of the state first.!!
BTW: I'm a out law to. I have a 12r that is modded out, But all the stock junk is sitting in the garge.

Kurt

Mind over Matter:
If you don't mind, then it don't matter!

Def. of a man:
We spend 9 months trying to get out and the rest of our lifes trying to get back in!\

Last edited by gone14s; 09-30-2010 at 10:31 AM.
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post #7 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 10:35 AM Thread Starter
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...Orginally the bill was to take effect next year and be retroactive to 1983 bikes!
As an Outlaw Biker, I have to say I think that would be pretty tough on some owners of the older bikes. There wasn't a lot of emissions stuff on those bikes, but finding stock pipes to put back on could get spendy and difficult, and they may have after market stuff on becasue the original pipes wore out (arguably, I guess).

My pipe is not overly loud compared to the stock pipe, but if I had to I could return the bike to completely stock - completely, including emissions - in an afternoon.

I got burned badly once when I misplaced the air pump for a beautiful 1974 Capri. When it came time to smog it, I couldn't find the original and the junk yards were picked clean. I keep all my stock stuff now. Once bitten,and all that....

Tom

Tom [email protected]

“The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother.” -Philip Marlowe

“'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used.” -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem
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post #8 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 10:40 AM
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74 Capri....lol
You missed it by one year Tom.....

Look at it this way, Meg get to be Govenor and Ca. goes up on Ebay.

Kurt

Mind over Matter:
If you don't mind, then it don't matter!

Def. of a man:
We spend 9 months trying to get out and the rest of our lifes trying to get back in!\

Last edited by gone14s; 09-30-2010 at 10:43 AM.
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post #9 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 01:43 PM
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You guys have missed the point of this "new" law. It has nothing to do with enforcing noise limits on vehicles. The laws to enforce noise limits have been on the books in California since the late fifties. If your vehicle is made prior to 1970 is has a noise limit of 92 decibels. The law to enforce this limit is 27151v.c. In the late 60's legislators began working to reduce noise emissions from all vehicles. What they came up with is the following,

Section 27202vc.
After 1969 and before 1972, 88 decibels
After 1972 and before 1975, 86 decibels
After 1974 and before 1986, 83 decibels
After 1985....................... 80 decibels.

For the past 25 years, any vehicle manufactured for sale in California has met this 80 decibel limit and the section to enforce this limit has been 27151v.c. This section does not carry a "fine" but it is considered a mechanical defect citation or "fix-it" ticket. Upon showing the court proof of correction it is dismissed with a $25 dismissal fee to cover court cost. (this amount varies from county to county) I have not fully read this new law because I retired 15 months ago and no longer care, lol, but from what I understand it really does not alter current enforcement of noise limits but it does enact a FINE of $100 for the first offense which goes up to $200 for a second offense and higher fines for subsequent violations plus court costs. So whether or not you correct the violation it will now cost you $100 each time you get stopped for loud pipes. Sorry for the long posts but like my dad always told me, when it comes to politicians, FOLLOW THE MONEY.

Thanks for your time, Greg
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post #10 of 18 Old 09-30-2010, 05:04 PM Thread Starter
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Greg –

I would beg to differ. It might be semantics or a fine point, but I do believe the new law is about enforcing noise limits (and, even as an Outlaw Biker*, I think that’s a good idea). A LEO can't simply allege that it sounded too loud; that's too easy to challenge.

True, the CVC does specify limits on noise, but the enforcement of those limits is difficult as it requires measurement equipment and a procedure to determine that the noise is above acceptable limits. You've got to stop the vehicle, find a place to test it, then conduct the test as specified, and I assume that most agencies would use the procedure outlined by the CHP.

This new legislation attacks the noise, and enforces the noise limits, though the back door of “emissions tampering”. The most obvious tampering would be the replacement of the EPA approved exhaust system.

And I don’t believe it’s about the money. It costs/will cost the state more to enforce the law (pull ever, write ticket, process ticket, man the follow-up, clear the fix-it) than even the $400 fine you get for the fourth time you’re cited. Look at the annual budget for any municipality. Then fine every motorcyclist in that municipality $1000. Compare the fines to the budget and it won't amount ot a pee hole in a snowbank, so ratcheting up enforcement on motorcycles has too poor a rate of return to be worthwhile.

It’s about the noise. One article in the LA Times a few weeks back recounted the story of some Agoura Hills residents who were sick and tired of hearing hordes of motorcyclists thundering up the canyon every Saturday and Sunday morning. They called their representatives and complained. As have thousands of others in cities and towns around the country.

Now, there are some people who just loathe the existence of some things, even if a reasonable individual would say that it couldn’t possibly affect them. My favorite shooting range in Redlands was shut down because people objected to it being there, even though it had been there since well before most of them were born and they could neither hear it nor get struck by errant hunks of burnin' hot lead. For the most part, though, people like the residents of Agoura Hills could care less about a horde of motorcyclists whispering up the canyon. If they can’t hear ‘em, they don’t care one whit.

Tom

*I hope everyone realizes this ‘Outlaw Biker’ thing is completely tongue-in-cheek…

Tom [email protected]

“The kid poured him another straight rye and I think he doctored it with water down behind the bar because when he came up with it he looked as guilty as if he'd kicked his grandmother.” -Philip Marlowe

“'Why' and 'How' are words so important they cannot be too often used.” -Napoleon Bonaparte

Sting like a butterfly.
Noli Timere Messorem

Last edited by Tom Schmitz; 09-30-2010 at 05:18 PM.
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