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^^^What he said.
 

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They can fix it. They are in Petaluma, CA.
Bicycle part Motor vehicle Font Gas Auto part
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Thank you for the responses. And of course, PDWestman was absolutely correct (obviously) when he said I didn't need to pull the engine. I think once I pull the jug, I'll flush the case with kerosene to make sure there's no loose bits in it
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
So I went ahead and bought a bunch of parts for the bike:

EM 685 kit
Thermobob 2 kit
Doohickey kit w/ tool and gaskets
Subframe thru-bolt kit
Low profile drain plug
KLX kit
Petcock conversion kit
Complete hose kit.

I would like to eventually upgrade the muffler, but for right now, just getting the engine ready. I'm going to pull the head and jug this week, and clean the carb.
 

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Nobody agrees with me, but I maintain that the thru-bolt for the subframe is a stupid ****ing idea, especially on a Gen 2. It stands to do more harm than good. With the upgraded bolts on the Gen 2 it is unnecessary unless you are incapable of torquing bolts properly. On a Gen 1 it is better to upgrade the bolts than to drill through the frame.

It's one of those ideas that, on paper, is good. In practice, it is stupid.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Nobody agrees with me, but I maintain that the thru-bolt for the subframe is a stupid ****ing idea, especially on a Gen 2. It stands to do more harm than good. With the upgraded bolts on the Gen 2 it is unnecessary unless you are incapable of torquing bolts properly. On a Gen 1 it is better to upgrade the bolts than to drill through the frame.

It's one of those ideas that, on paper, is good. In practice, it is stupid.
Good news is; I haven't drilled anything yet, and I can hold off. I will do more research, but you may have a valid argument.
 

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The Gen 2 has upgraded bolts for the subframe. If they are torqued properly then the break-out force of the pinched tubes of the subframe is probably exceeded by the bolts' shear strength.

To install the drill-through, you will be drilling through a solid section that is welded into the frame's backbone. You need to increase the existing blind hole diameter by about .10" and you have to drill halfway through the solid section, then turn around and drill through from the opposite side. In order for the bolt to pass through, the two drillings need to be almost perfectly coaxial. On some frames (I can't remember if it is the earlier or the later) that solid section is rather reduced in diameter, so there is a potential for break-through. When you are all done, you have one bolt to hold the subframe together instead of two. On paper, the joint is much stronger. In real life, you have done nothing to increase the break-out strength of the subframe's pinched ends. You've created a lot of work, a lot of chips, a lot of mess, and not gained much IMNSHO.

If you have good machine-shop skills and a decent drill motor you can probably do it without doing harm. I'm a pretty fair hand with machine shop shit and I thought it was ****ing stupid. Just keep the bolts torqued properly.

Don't get me started on footpeg bolts. Just keep them tight, too.

A general observation from a dick, not directed at you:
I don't know why people have to be told to torque bolts, and then periodically check them. I just don't. ¯\(ツ)/¯ Folks like to not do that, then complain about the poor quality of the bolts. It's a poor mechanic that blames his tools and fasteners.
 

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Nobody agrees with me, but I maintain that the thru-bolt for the subframe is a stupid ****ing idea, especially on a Gen 2. It stands to do more harm than good. With the upgraded bolts on the Gen 2 it is unnecessary unless you are incapable of torquing bolts properly. On a Gen 1 it is better to upgrade the bolts than to drill through the frame.

It's one of those ideas that, on paper, is good. In practice, it is stupid.

Well, I may not be a somebody but I think I'm more than a nobody! :LOL:

I pretty much agree with you. My buddy had a Gen1 subframe bolt shear in the Baja with his wife on the back so I did the EM drill through mod on my 2001......and though it is a quality pce that will undoubtably outlast the rest of the bike, it was a gigantic PITA and I've since decided that since I don't have paniers, top boxes and I don't carry passengers or weigh 300 lbs that I don't NEED the drill through kit. So, on my 2000, I simply upgraded the bolts and torqued them properly - it isn't quite as strong but I don't anticipate any problems. As you say, Gen2's have bigger bolts to begin with.


Dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Well I am 230 lbs buck naked, so I am also going to change the rear shock spring to something stiffer. Would my weight be an issue with the subframe bolt?
 

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Would my weight be an issue with the subframe bolt?
No, your weight won't be an issue with properly torqued fasteners. Fully dressed and booted, with a full Chase Alaska bag on the rack, I have slabbed in at close to 300 pounds sitting on the seat and rack. Add to that some full panniers that are essentially mounted to the subframe. Never had a problem but, of course, was not riding some whoops at full tilt in that configuration. Rough trails, yes, but at sane speeds. If you want to ride whoops at full speed and heavily loaded you ought TIG the subframe to the main frame, or buy the right bike.

Truth be told, I've only ever seen one subframe that was broken where I knew the owner had properly torqued stuff up. It broke way in the back near the rack. He was also the guy nobody could keep up with. His broke on Henness Pass and we kinda sorta put it back together with some sticks and duct tape and he made it home to Paso Robles.
 
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Nobody agrees with me, but I maintain that the thru-bolt for the subframe is a stupid ****ing idea, especially on a Gen 2. It stands to do more harm than good. With the upgraded bolts on the Gen 2 it is unnecessary unless you are incapable of torquing bolts properly. On a Gen 1 it is better to upgrade the bolts than to drill through the frame.

It's one of those ideas that, on paper, is good. In practice, it is stupid.
Agreed. So at least you got one guy on your side :p
 
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Well I am 230 lbs buck naked, so I am also going to change the rear shock spring to something stiffer. Would my weight be an issue with the subframe bolt?
The Top Gun 7.4 kg/mm spring will suit your weight very well. Got the same setup on my bike.
As Tom has mentioned, upgrading the subframe bolts is a good idea rather than doing the drill-thru option.
 
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As Tom has ranted on and on about, upgrading the subframe bolts is a good idea rather than doing the drill-thru option.
Fixed that for ya.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
So I spoke with engine dynamics about it, sent pictures and now I'm waiting to hear back. In the meantime, I bought a 2006 gen 1 head without cams, but caps included. The seller says the can journals are good, but has a bent intake valve. I'm guessing that the can chain jumped a tooth or two to cause that. Anyways, I figured I could use this head if needed. I looked up buying separate caps, but that was $85, whereas the entire head was $200.
 

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The $85 caps might have been good money after bad. The cam journals are line bored as a set, caps and head. Interchangeability is not expected. They are all pretty close and there are times when caps from a different head will work just fine (though you might have to turn them backward) and times when they won't. You just have to PlastiGage them and see, running a strand all the way around.

On the other hand, $200 for a head is an extremely good find.
 
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
On the other hand, $200 for a head is an extremely good find.
That's exactly why I jumped on it. I messaged him to make sure the journals were good. Said they were, so I went for it. I just an email back from engine dynamics, and damn, they're not cheap. I'm really hoping this head pays off. I'll throw it in the ultrasonic this weekend to clean it up. Now I have to buy a exhaust cam, and not sure whether I should buy a used stock one, buy an aftermarket one "hot cam", or buy the "hot cam" set.

Is there any mods that can be done to increase oil flow to the head to prevent something like this happening again? I'm aware of increasing the hole size on the oil line banjo bolts.
 

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As a part of the "oil line banjo bolt mod" (PDW oil mod) you can install a restriction in the oil galley that feeds the crank. That forces more oil over to the cam/transmission side of the system.

Without having good headwork done (which, counter-intuitively, means making the intake port volume smaller) the engine's performance won't gain what you'd like it to for the amount of money being spent on a hot cam. Best to go with the stock cam. Arguably, you can gain some performance increase by advancing the exhaust cam one tooth on the cam sprocket. This is called the 'MC Mod' and many people insist it increases performance, supported by no data or explicable theory. It has been demonstrated that it reduces engine braking and increases starting compression, to the detriment of cold starts. But hey, it doesn't cost anything other than half an hour's time to change the timing (and half an hour to put it back if you don't like it).

You might find these articles of some interest, especially if your morning ritual requires extensive sitting on the porcelain throne...



Attached is what I was able to salvage of KLRChris' head modifications he used to build his 60hp KLR engine.
 

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Ditto what Tom said. But I'd say ditto to almost anything Tom says (except that he's a dick).

I counsel Zen. The KLR motor is a low to mid-RPM torquey agricultural implement. Accept that, and your life will be a whole lot easier, less expensive, and you'll end up with a lot more time meditating on the seat, instead of on the garage floor. Stick with the stock cams. Otherwise, buy something in orange or blue or red. ;)

Re forcing more oil to the head and cam bearings: Virtually no one has problems with cam bearing wear or damage UNLESS they run too low on oil. That seems to be the only thing that kills them. While PDW oil system mods work to send more oil pressure to the cams, and I have done them on several of my KLRs, the reality is that they are not needed if you keep your oil level in the window. If you let the oil level get to almost empty, then even those mods may give you a few more seconds or a minute of operation, but ultimately will not save your cam bearings.

Note, the oil level can get below 1 quart and still provide enough lubrication to keep the cam bearings running. But, that is NOT recommended!
 

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Is there any mods that can be done to increase oil flow to the head to prevent something like this happening again?

LET Me say Loud & Clear to Everyone reading This.
MY PDW oil flow modifications were Developed to REDUCE oil CONSUMPTION past the piston rings.

Never was Intended to save the camshafts from the Total Lack of Lubrication / Cooling Oil Flow Caused by TOO LOW of oil level in the Crankcase.
THAT is up to the rider of the bike.
CHECK your oil Level every chance you get!!! It takes mere seconds with a fully warm engine to confirm that the oil level is at half a window or above! Maybe 30 seconds to a minute with cold oil in the morning if bike was parked on the sidestand.
 
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