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Ok tom, here we go,im a first gen mecanic, from 1993 i had 16 years. in 95 looking for more power on mi engines, the klr blue one is my own ,i bought 4 years ago, like every one, i was wanting for more power, i comes limitaded in main jets, exaust and cdi, , if i put a big bore kit is almost the same thing, you cant. Have all power( limitaded for emision gases and minus power ) so i weld looking to have more larger magneto sensor tab(pista) taking out the engine limiter, lose a little but more revs and minus vibration at 3500 rpm, i will explane it has the same mufler, mainjets ,cdi(original) and evething and runs like hell the only thing i put a 16 teeth front and rear 43 now ,it doesnt brake ,the fork twist(need a fork brace) and doestn get hotter or consume oil ,anything else need the klr to compite to de v strom650 or bmw, or another brand! My aportation for the world( try it ,what you have to loose?)
 

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Discussion Starter #42
¿Puede proporcionar detalles y una descripción paso a paso de lo que hizo? Todavía estoy un poco confundido.

Un rotor se parece a un Gen 1 con una pieza de metal más larga. ¿Utilizaste el CDI chino con esta parte?

El otro parece un rotor 2012+. ¿Usaste un Gen 2 con este?

Llamamos a la caja de encendido Gen 1 un CDI. El Gen 2 se llama TCBI. Transistor Controlled Breakerless Ignition
 

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¿Puede proporcionar detalles y una descripción paso a paso de lo que hizo? Todavía estoy un poco confundido.
Yo, tambien.

I wonder . . . is the Chinese "CDI" an actual CDI, or . . . a version of an Inductive Discharge Ignition (as in, stock Generation 2 ignitions)? Regardless, CDIs and IDIs use ignition coils with different characteristics, for optimal operation (maybe both will work with either coil, but the impedance mis-match may exact a price).

Don't want to be excessively pedantic (Moi? Moi? Miss Piggy's voice.), but the CDI ignition coil works more as a TRANSFORMER, while the IDI ignition coil functions more as an INDUCTOR.

Again, maybe either ignition coil works with either ignition discharge system without noticeable performance difference.

Still . . . the respective ignition coils have different electrical resistances . . .
 

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Magneto original de klr650 modificado, se aumentó pista 8mm para mover avance y dar los 38 grados en altas Rev. En vez de 30grados originales, tiene el CDI original , como lo trae el klr 600 y la KTM

Original magneto of modified klr650, reluctor bar was increased 8mm to move dvance and give 38 degrees at full advance, instead of the original 30 degrees It has the original CDI, as used by the klr 600 and the KTM
 

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Moto gen 1, con magneto y instalación eléctrica de gen2 , recortada la pista de magneto para trabajar con CDI( corriente directa)d.c fabricación china y se modificó la instalación para que pudiera funcionar, a lo que se responde la pregunta ,si se puede trabajar la gen2 con un CDI(corriente directa) chino, en teoría hay un chino que debe funcionar para no recortar el magneto solo haciendo las conexiones apropiadas

gen 1 motorcycle, with magneto and electrical installation of gen2, cut the reluctor bar to work with a Chinese DC CDI and the installation was modified so that it could work, to which the question is answered, if you can work the gen2 with a Chinese DC CDI, in theory there is a Chinese CDI that must work without the need to cut the reluctor bar, just making the appropriate connections
 

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Like damocles ask, tes you can adapt a Chinese, ,the conections are diferent , and tes you can use the same coil, the thing is the pulse of CDI goes ti the coil, and the positive of the coil goes ti de positive of CDI , and the other cable of the coil goes to earth ir negativo there are some pics of the conections , im sure there os a CDI than can fit without modificare the magneto tab, It can be the sach 125 madass CDI (d.c) IMG_20190909_231804_1568089932660.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #48 (Edited)
Muchas gracias por las explicaciones! Ahora tengo muy claro lo que hiciste.

Algunas personas aquí han usado el magneto Gen 2 en el Gen 1.

Están tratando de obtener más energía eléctrica del alternador. Descubrieron que obtendrían un mal fallo de encendido si no acortaban la barra reluctora.

¡Su enfoque para cambiar a un gran avance de encendido es muy interesante!

Gracias por compartirlo.

Thank you very much for the explanation! Now I am very clear what you did.

Some people here have used the Gen 2 magneto in Gen 1.

They are trying to get more electric power from the alternator. They discovered that they would get a bad misfire if they did not shorten the reluctor bar.

Your approach to creating an ignition with greater advance is very interesting!

Thanks for sharing.
 

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[Upside-down exclamation point]Claro!

:)

Ahora, nosotros sabemos los tamanos [little squiggly thingy over the "n"] de AC y DC CDIs. DC es mas grande, por que lo necescita un inverter para AC.

--------------------------

Clear!

Now we know the sizes of AC and DC CDIs. DC is bigger, because it needs an inverter for AC.
 

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The ac is for gen1 or when the magneto coil that feeds de CDI is damage , you can put a d.c feed from battery (for the diagram gen 1 d.c.chinese later i Will post how to conect ..)
 

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I post a video on you tube called (klr650 con cerebro chino) that is working with the d.c .CDI Chinese ,with the magneto gen2 modificated for that , the photos i upload before
 

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Damocles i still dont indestand , your question, and for what is the inverter?
Short answer: The INVERTER converts DC into AC, permitting transforming 12 VDC into maybe, say, 400-600 V AC(or more). The higher-voltage AC is rectified, charges a capacitor, then . . . the capacitor is discharged through the ignition coil's primary windings, the consequent pulse transformed to an even higher voltage through the ignition coil's secondary windings, causing a spark.

Long answer (courtesy WikipediA):

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AC-CDI
The AC-CDI module obtains its electricity source solely from the alternating current produced by the alternator. [As in Generation 1 KLR650s] The AC-CDI system is the most basic CDI system which is widely used in small engines.

Note that not all small engine ignition systems are CDI. Some engines like older Briggs and Stratton use magneto ignition. [There we have it; "magneto ignition," an arrangement I tried (unsuccessfully) to reference in a previous discussion with another poster.] The entire ignition system, coil and points, are under the magnetized flywheel. [Note: Just incidentally, a "magneto ignition" uses coil and points.]

Another sort of ignition system commonly used on small off-road motorcycles in the 1960s and 1970s was called Energy Transfer. A coil under the flywheel generated a strong DC current pulse as the flywheel magnet moved over it. This DC current flowed through a wire to an ignition coil mounted outside of the engine. The points sometimes were under the flywheel for two-stroke engines, and commonly on the camshaft for four-stroke engines. This system worked like all Kettering (points/coil) ignition systems... the opening points trigger the collapse of the magnetic field in the ignition coil, producing a high voltage pulse which flows through the spark plug wire to the spark plug.

If the engine was rotated while examining the wave-form output of the coil with an oscilloscope, it would appear to be AC. Since the charge-time of the coil corresponds to much less than a full revolution of the crank, the coil really 'sees' only DC current for charging the external ignition coil.

Some electronic ignition systems exist that are not CDI. [As in, Generation 2 KLR650s.] These systems use a transistor to switch the charging current to the coil off and on at the appropriate times. This eliminated the problem of burned and worn points, and provided a hotter spark because of the faster voltage rise and collapse time in the ignition coil.

DC-CDI
The DC-CDI module is powered by the battery, and therefore an additional DC/AC inverter circuit is included in the CDI module to raise the 12 V DC to 400-600 V DC, making the CDI module slightly larger. [NOT the case for Generation 2 KLR650s; the model has no stinkin' CDI whatsoever.] However, vehicles that use DC-CDI systems have more precise ignition timing and the engine can be started more easily when cold.

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Summary (in the general context of engines, as on motorcycles):

AC-CDIs are powered by alternating current from the engine's fundamental electric power system. [Think alternator, stator.]

DC-CDIs are powered by low-voltage DC [As in, rectified, regulated 12 VDC], but must have an inverter in the circuit to convert the DC to AC for high voltage step-up; consequent higher-voltage rectified and used to charge a capacitor.

MAGNETO IGNITIONS [As the phrase is commonly used in Ignitioniana] have no CDI whatsoever, rather, consist of inductive discharge systems with contact points.

Now, WikipediA, and I, HAVE SPOKEN! :)
 

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Thanks for the story, i know ,what is, but , i dont understan for what can you aplicate on this? Or better question, what is that u want to do, or whats on you mind working???
 

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Or better question, what is that u want to do, or whats on you mind working???
Nothing whatever, Alejandro!

I was just wondering about the application of aftermarket CDIs, whether DC or AC, whether applied to Generation 1s or Generation 2s . . . trying to reconcile the many differences between the respective components (as in, pickup coil, rotor (involving timing lump), ignition coil, etc. And, wondering about the performance consequences, should non-optimum components become orchestrated into any CDI transplant . . . maybe, how AC was connected to an AC CDI from a Generation 2 stator (parallel to the rectifier/regulator input circuitry?). . . perhaps . . . what does the spark advance curve look like from the aftermarket CDIs . . . etc.

Is mentioned in previous posts, I wondered at the difference in size between AC- and DC-powered CDIs; assuming (as stated) the DC versions requirement for an inverter resulted in a larger package than the AC's.

So, back to your question . . . just idle speculation and postulation!

Congratulations on your own successful incorporation of aftermarket (Chinese-manufactured) CDIs!
 
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