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Discussion Starter #22
So, I started on the front tire change today, and it looks like they're tubeless. Not sure how you can tell that from the outside. The old tire does say tubeless on it, but so do the ones on my bicycle and I still run 'em with tubes, so...

I already bought tubes, and even though I think the Shinko 705s can run tubeless, I think I'd rather just put in the tubes. Is this OK?

Also, I'm wrestling with this tire, trying to get it off. Looking at some of these KLR650 videos YouTube, it looks like they're having a lot easier time. I'm wondering if tubeless tires are just tighter on the rim? I'm scared that I'm going to damage/bend the rim. I've mixed a few drops of Dr. Bronner's with water and lubed it up, broke the bead on both side, etc.

Looking for assurance/advice before I proceed any further :)
 

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Keep the bead of the tire that you are currently working with compressed into the spoke WELL/ drop-center of the rim and you will eventually succeed.
 

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<...>

I already bought tubes, and even though I think the Shinko 705s can run tubeless, I think I'd rather just put in the tubes. Is this OK?

Also, I'm wrestling with this tire, trying to get it off. Looking at some of these KLR650 videos YouTube, it looks like they're having a lot easier time. I'm wondering if tubeless tires are just tighter on the rim? I'm scared that I'm going to damage/bend the rim. I've mixed a few drops of Dr. Bronner's with water and lubed it up, broke the bead on both side, etc.

Looking for assurance/advice before I proceed any further :)
The Shinko 705s can indeed be run tubeless but not with a stock KLR rim. The stock rims of the KLR are meant to be used with tubes, and the Shinko's are perfectly fine with one.
 

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Hey - I wish I'd have seen this earlier! I was changing both front and rear tires this weekend, and could have offered some local help.

RE: "Tubeless?" - If there are spokes, and it's not a German bike, there are probably going to be tubes in the tires - "tubeless" tires can take tubes, just like your bicycle.

RE: Removal- The internet videos always make it look easy, but that's the magic of cinema - it's amazing what a little judicious editing can do...
Getting the old tire off is the "easy part"; after you squeeze the sides of the tire to break the bead, squeeze one of your spoons into the gap between the tire and the rim and open it up enough to get another spoon in there. As noted above, it helps to get the other side of the tire seated in the drop-center of the rim, so I usually kneel on the opposite side that I'm "spooning". After that, take little bites with the spoons to lift the tire over the rim, and eventually you'll be able to pull it off the rim with your hands. It is a feat of brute strength - but it gets easier as you get more of the tire off the rim.

Good luck and let us know how it turned out.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
Hey - I wish I'd have seen this earlier! I was changing both front and rear tires this weekend, and could have offered some local help.

RE: "Tubeless?" - If there are spokes, and it's not a German bike, there are probably going to be tubes in the tires - "tubeless" tires can take tubes, just like your bicycle.

Good luck and let us know how it turned out.
I had the spoon in there and looked at the valve stem, which was sealed on the inside with nuts, and the valve stem wasn't attached to a tube. Went fishing in there a bit with my fingers and could feel the tube. The spoke wells look sealed, and the rims don't look stock. The stock ones on the 2nd gen are chrome. The ones on my bike are black. (But maybe they came in different colors? IDK.)

I still might need some help. I'm working mostly this week. Will try to get to it if I have some time. They're currently baking in the sun right now, in the hopes that the heat will make the rubber a bit more malleable, but was probably gonna mess around with it some more this weekend, so if you're around, and aren't busy, I wouldn't mind some help.

And yeah, magic of cinema heh. Making everything look easy, but I imagine if the tires are in fact tubeless, then they'd be a bit harder to take off, since they not only have to bead, but also hold air at high pressure. (I did read somewhere that tubeless tire beads are a bit beefier because they have to be airtight.)
 

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You say the valve stem wasn't attached to a tube, but you could feel the tube in there? That's weird... Once you get inside the tire, you should be able to see the inner tube pretty clearly. Letting the tires warm up in the sun will help, and I've found the front tire is easier than the back one.
- For what it's worth, my bike (2014.5) has stock black rims, so that's not too unusual.

Good luck and keep at it. The first one is the worst one and, although it's always a pain in the butt, it gets better...
 

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Discussion Starter #29
RE: Removal- The internet videos always make it look easy, but that's the magic of cinema - it's amazing what a little judicious editing can do...
Getting the old tire off is the "easy part"; after you squeeze the sides of the tire to break the bead, squeeze one of your spoons into the gap between the tire and the rim and open it up enough to get another spoon in there. As noted above, it helps to get the other side of the tire seated in the drop-center of the rim, so I usually kneel on the opposite side that I'm "spooning". After that, take little bites with the spoons to lift the tire over the rim, and eventually you'll be able to pull it off the rim with your hands. It is a feat of brute strength - but it gets easier as you get more of the tire off the rim.
You say the valve stem wasn't attached to a tube, but you could feel the tube in there? That's weird... Once you get inside the tire, you should be able to see the inner tube pretty clearly. Letting the tires warm up in the sun will help, and I've found the front tire is easier than the back one.
- For what it's worth, my bike (2014.5) has stock black rims, so that's not too unusual.

Good luck and keep at it. The first one is the worst one and, although it's always a pain in the butt, it gets better...
Typo! My bad, I couldn't feel the tube in there.
 

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Yikes - if they really are tubeless tires, that'd explain why they are so tight. I'm sure that someone around here knows the tricks to changing tubeless tires, but I'd imagine that's going to require some really high air pressure and such.

- Fortunately, you live near a world-famous motorcycle tire shop! Give Woody's Wheel Works (Woody's Wheel Works - Custom Motorcycle Wheels & Services) a call and ask them for their advice/input - they're very well regarded, super friendly, and they specialize in spoked adventure motorcycle wheels and repairs. They'll get you back on the right track, and it's totally worth a call.

PS: I'm not a shill or anything - they've helped me out and I'd recommend them to a friend.
 

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Typo! My bad, I couldn't feel the tube in there.
I'll suggest that the chances are high that your inner tube has ripped completely off of the valve stem.
There is normally a cupped washer held firmly by a nut on most inner tubes.
There is normally a thin, stretched on rubber band covering the spoke heads to help protect the inner tube from chaffing. It will NOT seal air pressure into the tire.

Your bike is probably new enough that it came standard with those Black Rims.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
There is normally a cupped washer held firmly by a nut on most inner tubes.
There is normally a thin, stretched on rubber band covering the spoke heads to help protect the inner tube from chaffing. It will NOT seal air pressure into the tire.
It looked like it was more than just a cupped washer though. It was circular though, I think. I honestly didn't get a good look at it. I think it also had knurling on the outside.
I'll try to take a photo of it and post it tomorrow sometime.

And, yeah, I know about the rubber covering. They have those on bicycles too; I think they're called "rim strips". You can buy proper ones, or do what I do and use Black Gorilla Tape.

Like I said, I'll try to post photos of it tomorrow.

Granted I haven't changed a motorcycle tire before, I've changed my fair share of bicycle tires, and I like to think I can gauge fairly well when too much pressure is being applied on the rim when I'm going in there with the spoons; I think I'm right at that point where I might dent the rim.

If they're tubeless (which I think they are), then I'll probably just take 'em off the bike and bring 'em to one of the shops close by.
 

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Discussion Starter #33 (Edited)
I guess I just underestimated how strong the rims are, and maybe overestimated how strong I am.
Finally got the tire off. It was tubed, and "pdwestman" was somewhat correct in that the inner tube was basically ripped off from the valve stem.

Anyway, hopefully I'll have this front tire on here soon.

For anyone reading this, three spoons seem to be the magic number. Albeit you could do it with two, three makes it much easier.

QUESTION: after researching a bit, there seems to be varying opinions, but my tube came with two nuts. Some say to put one on the inside of the wheel and one on the outside. Some say that you use both, locking out on the outside of the wheel. Any opinions on this?
 
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