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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
hello
im looking for some advise about wiring my '86 klr 250
hope you can help me out or point me to someone who knows about wiring a CDI

the wire colours dont match any diagram !!
the cdi unfortunatly doesnt have the original plug connector, just wires coming out of it...
im trying to build a new wire harness

CDI (its a denso 21119-1180)

Black -
Red - power from stator
Red/Green -
Blue/Green -
Black/White - Killswitch circuit?
White -
Red/Black – ground to have spark (sidestand switch etc kills it)

MAGNETO

Yellow - power to Rectifier
Yellow - power to Rectifier
Red - Power to CDI
White -

PICKUP COIL

Black/Yellow - to ??? on CI
Black - to ??? on CI

RECTIFIER
Yellow: power from Magneto
Yellow: power from Magneto
White: power to battery?
Brown: power from ignition switch?
hope sooo much that anyone is able to help me! thanks in advance!!
 

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Posting wiring diagram.

KILL mechanism is GROUNDING stator power lead to CDI.





Since you say authentic wire color codes do not exist, you may have to do some detective work, chasing down wires for continuity with a multimeter.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
thanks for the reply
im still not clear on what to do, theres just no wiring diagram out there that is similar to my cdi, thus not giving me any clear direction on where to go.
i wouldnt really know how to chase down the wires, maybe i need to learn how exactly a cdi works?

im considering ordering a replacement cdi, oem, in the hope that the colours on it will match any diagrams

this is what i got:
 

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A modest proposal:

Contact the CDI manufacturer/vendor; ask them how to hook up the device to your specific motorcycle.

They might share a helpful wiring diagram of their own, showing connections, etc.

Also, you might engage a knowledgeable technician and/or shop experienced in the desired installation.
 

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According to the Wiring Diagram I have for my Gen 1 KLR 650:

R/Gr = Changes to a B wire en-route to a B wire at the Pick-up Coil.
Bl/R = Changes to a B/R wire en-route to a B/Y wire at the Pick-up Coil.
R = R wire at the Stator
B = B/Y wire which is the General Ground Circuit
R/B = R/B wire to the Diode Unit
B/W = B/W wire to the Ignition Switch, Stator and Kill Switch
B/W = B wire to the Ignition Coil and Tachometer

While these color codes don't match up perfectly; by process of elimination a solution may be within reach?
 

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Check the KLR250 wiring diagram for parity with your KLR650 wire colors, Bluehighways!

May be the same.

One apparent circuit difference: 250 powers ignition with one main stator coil, vs. two separate exciter coils on a Generation 1 KLR650.

Even after identifying connections to components on his bike, the OP must know which connections he should make to his aftermarket CDI. Here is where the manufacturer/vendor can make a valuable contribution. IMHO.
 

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Check the KLR250 wiring diagram for parity with your KLR650 wire colors, Bluehighways!

May be the same.

One apparent circuit difference: 250 powers ignition with one main stator coil, vs. two separate exciter coils on a Generation 1 KLR650.

Even after identifying connections to components on his bike, the OP must know which connections he should make to his aftermarket CDI. Here is where the manufacturer/vendor can make a valuable contribution. IMHO.
21119-1180 is the genuine Kawasaki oem part # for the igniter on a KLR250.
But electricity is my biggest down-fall. So I will politely defer to Damocles, who does actually own and ride a KLR250 & understands electricity.
 

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OK, Sword of . . . .

The challenge is that most wiring diagrams for the KLR250 show the Wiring Harness for the Bike plugging directly into the CDI Unit. In fact the Wiring Harness plugs into a set of two Pig Tails that are a part of the CDI Unit and these Pig Tail Wires are not color coded the same as the Bike's Wiring Harness that it attaches to. This is because Denso makes the CDI Unit for many customers and then each customer (Kawasaki in this case) hooks it up to their own Wiring Harness. It's luck of the draw that any of the color codes actually match up.

Anyhow . . . I've attached a diagram both as a *.jpg file and as a *.pdf file. This diagram shows three things: 1.) What the Wiring Diagrams, like the one you posted here show, 2.) What you have in your hands and 3.) The translation from one to the other. In other words; what you want.

Let us know how things go for you.

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #10
wow thats the best, you're the best. thanks so much!!!
i'll be back from vacation in 10 days, first thing i do after i drop my bag is run to the garage and get this thing fired up.
cant wait! will post back once its running.


thanks everyone too!

:grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2::grin2:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
hi
so maybe you might be wondering: why is that guy not posting a video of the bike, running smoothly.
the reason is, i still cant get a spark out of this thing. so im thinking maybe something is broken.
ik getting 8 tot 10 volts on the black/white wire each kick. but no spark.
this is how i wired it up:

 

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That you are seeing a pulsing voltage on the wire, that connects the the Ignition Coil to the CDI Module tells me that everything is probably working properly, at least this far.

The "this far" part means that some more information is needed, or the diagnostic steps will get very complex. So two questions, and things should sort themselves out very quickly:

1.) You have posted two very different Wiring Diagrams and I don't know which is the one for your bike. How to proceed with the diagnosis depends on which of these two Wiring Diagrams is the "correct" Wiring Diagram for your bike's Ignition Circuit. So, here's the first question: Please look at the Ignition Coil and tell us how many wires there are. There could be one small wire and one big wire. The big wire being the one that attaches the Ignition Coil to the Spark Plug. -OR- There will be two small wires, on separate terminals, plus the one big wire. The big wire being the one that attaches the Ignition Coil to the Spark Plug. Telling us which one you have (picture would be even better) will tell us which Wiring Diagram is the correct Wiring Diagram for the bike you are working on.

Edit: I have attached three pictures. One of what I have labeled as "Ignition Coil #1" and two that I have labeled "Ignition Coil #2" Can you tell us which one looks like the one on your bike?

2.) When you say that you are seeing a pulsing voltage on the wire that connects the CDI Module to the Ignition Coil, where exactly are you hooking up your voltmeter? At the Ignition Coil, or at the CDI Module?

Hang in there, you're almost done!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Hey bluehighways
Thanks for the reply
1. I have one wire in on big wire out
2. I took the wite from the cdi, hooked it up to the positive on the meter, grounded the negative on the negative on the battery

Hope to hear from you what im doing wrong! :)

Jakob
 

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I don't think you're doing anything wrong. In fact, it seems that (in the absence of much more sophisticated test equipment than you almost certainly do not have access to) you have verified that all of the most complicated electronics of the Ignition Circuit are working properly. Most excellent!

What is left is pretty basic stuff. There are really only a couple of things left that could be the cause of this problem: 1.) The Coil is lacking a good Ground Circuit. You can test this by attaching a jumper wire from the exposed Metal Frame of the Ignition Coil to the Negative Terminal of the Battery. If this solves the problem then you will need to clean the Exposed Metal Coil Frame and also clean (bright and shiny) whatever Metal it is attached/bolted to when installed on the bike. 2.) When you are "testing" this system be very sure the Outer Metal Shell of the Spark Plug has a good mechanical connection to Ground. Again the use of a Jumper Wire between the Outer Metal Shell of the Spark Plug (big alligator clip) and the Negative Terminal of the Battery can eliminate any possibility of a poor Ground Circuit here. 3.) Now do both Steps #1 and #2 at the same time. If success is not realized when both Steps #1 and Step #2 are done at the same time. I would suspect and feel fairly confident that the Ignition Coil is defective. But do not jump to this conclusion without performing all three of these steps in this order.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
still nothing
did all the steps but no spark
i ordered a new coil and a supplement manual (with the correct wiring diagrams) in it just to be sure

question: do you think its possible that i destroyed the CDi in the process of hooking all the wires up wrongly in multiple ways?
hope not, a CDI is quite expensive....
 

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question: do you think its possible that i destroyed the CDi in the process of hooking all the wires up wrongly in multiple ways?
hope not, a CDI is quite expensive....
A.) Not very likely.

That you are getting a pulsing voltage reading at the Coil says that the CDI Unit is almost certainly working. Short of putting an oscilloscope on it I can't be 100% certain, but at this point I'd say go ahead and replace the Ignition Coil. At the least it's far and away much cheaper than buying and learning how to use an oscilloscope or a very good (as in rather costly) peak/hold voltmeter.
 

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Before replacing the ignition coil, might test the old one:

Apply 12 VDC across primary windings; break circuit and observe whether spark jumps from high-voltage cable to ground connection.

This test procedure should work on a Generation 2 ignition coil; I think Generation 1 (and KLR250 ignition coil) also, although the Generation 1/KLR250 coil performs more as a transformer, rather than a saturated inductive circuit element.

=================

Just a fun fact: A CDI (Generation 1 and KLR250 ignition) creates a spark when a capacitor is discharged across the primary windings of the ignition coil. Generation 2 ignition coil primary windings are saturated by 12 VDC, then the saturating current circuit is broken and the collapsing electromagnetic field induces a high voltage in the secondary windings producing a spark.
 

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Before replacing the ignition coil, might test the old one:

Apply 12 VDC across primary windings; break circuit and observe whether spark jumps from high-voltage cable to ground connection.

This test procedure should work on a Generation 2 ignition coil; I think Generation 1 (and KLR250 ignition coil) also, although the Generation 1/KLR250 coil performs more as a transformer, rather than a saturated inductive circuit element.

=================

Just a fun fact: A CDI (Generation 1 and KLR250 ignition) creates a spark when a capacitor is discharged across the primary windings of the ignition coil. Generation 2 ignition coil primary windings are saturated by 12 VDC, then the saturating current circuit is broken and the collapsing electromagnetic field induces a high voltage in the secondary windings producing a spark.

Not real likely. A CDI Coil is a pulse transformer. You are correct in as much as a CDI Module discharges a Capacitor through the Coil to generate the voltage necessary to ionize the Spark Plug gap. But . . . the voltage applied by the CDI Module to the Ignition Coil is going to be in the neighborhood of 600 volts in order for this to happen. What you are suggesting is that by applying 12 volts the resuls should aproximate that of 600 volts. There are several other problems with trying to test a CDI Coil as if it were a traditional ground switched Ignition Coil.
 

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Haven't tried the 12-volt primary winding saturation test to a Generation 1 ignition coil myself, perhaps you have. Assuming a considerable step-up voltage function of said coil, I'd expect a spark from a mere 12-volt saturation, but . . . maybe not!

The "600 volts" you speak of is a momentary peak of a brief capacitor discharge, difficult to replicate with ordinary equipment and apparatus lying around. I thus suggested the ubiquitous 12 VDC for the proffered test.

Charging a capacitor to 600 volts and discharging it across the coil primary windings certainly approaches operational conditions more fully.

An "aside:" Ever wonder why Kawasaki marketing refers to Generation 2 ignition as, "Electric CDI?" We know, CDI it ain't! :)
 
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